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Tom Fettig
From:Ron Farrand <RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us>
Sent:Tuesday, February 27, 2018 10:31 AM
To:Tom Fettig
Subject:RE: Gate Project
Tom:
We do go into several gated communities. The communities have provided us with remote controls as we would not
allow the driver to leave the bus to operate a key pad. For just 7 homes I would prefer not going into the complex. It
looks to me like the bus will need to stop on 116th and any students would need to walk to the corner, but they would
need to be there when the bus arrives, we can’t wait for them to walk from the gate area. We do not require a bench for
waiting students. As long as there are sidewalks, perhaps widened out some for standing students, that is all we ask.
Given there are only a few children and they don’t attend our schools, it seems like the best thing is to assume we would
pick up at 116th if something changes in the future.
Ron Farrand Jr., RA
Director, Facilities and Transportation
Carmel Clay Schools
317-815-3962
Follow: CCS Transportation on Twitter ;
Carmel Clay Schools Transportation on Facebook ;
Carmel Clay Schools Facilities & Transportation Facebook .
From: Tom Fettig [mailto:tomfettig@lmlestatemanagement.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 9:04 AM
To: Ron Farrand <RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us>
Subject: RE: Gate Project
Mr. Farrand,
Thanks for the prompt reply. I have attached a preliminary plan that illustrates the constraints I am dealing with. I have
a bench located outside the gate, for the pick-up and drop-off area, along a proposed sidewalk into the neighborhood.
The subdivision control ordinance requires a 60’ vehicular stack beyond the 40’ R.O.W. That puts the gate well over 100’
from, in this case, 116th St. So, a bus would have to either stop on 116th St., then the students would have to walk to the
bus on 116th St.; or the bus would pick-up the students at the gate, then go through the gate into the neighborhood,
turnaround and leave. At that point, why not pick-up the student at the house?
Another requirement is to have a turnaround outside the gate with a minimum 24’ radius. The property lines do not
allow for anything larger. So, a bus would not be able to turn around outside the gate.
Maybe another solution is to provide the pick-up and drop-off area within the R.O.W. on the East side of Estancia Way,
closer to 116th St. Is this allowed? Would this be better?
This is kind of a unique situation. The neighborhood only has 7 homes. Of those, only 2 have school aged kids, and
those students attend private schools. The pick-up area would probably would not be used anytime in the near future.
I am curious as to how gated neighborhoods without a pick-up and drop-off area handle buses (such as Laurelwood). Do
bus drivers have codes for gated neighborhoods on their route?
Thanks again for your help and direction.
Best,
Tom Fettig
Graduate Landscape Architect
LML Estate Management
5728 N. Michigan Rd.
2
Indianapolis, Indiana 46228
317.690.2852 Mobile
317.536.0013 Office
317.536.0021 Fax
From: Ron Farrand [mailto:RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:24 AM
To: Tom Fettig <tomfettig@lmlestatemanagement.com>
Subject: RE: Gate Project
We do not require a shelter. There needs to be adequate space for students to stand or sit well back from the roadway.
It should be on the side of the entrance so that the bus is not blocking the road into the sub-division when stopped for
pick-up.
Ron Farrand Jr., RA
Director, Facilities and Transportation
Carmel Clay Schools
317-815-3962
Follow: CCS Transportation on Twitter ;
Carmel Clay Schools Transportation on Facebook ;
Carmel Clay Schools Facilities & Transportation Facebook .
From: Tom Fettig [mailto:tomfettig@lmlestatemanagement.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:20 AM
To: Ron Farrand <RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us>
Subject: Gate Project
Mr. Farrand,
Hello, I am working on a gate project for a client. The subdivision control ordinance requires a school bus pick-up and
drop-off area for newly constructed gates. I was wondering what that would typically entail. Does Carmel require a
structure or shelter? Or would a park bench located outside the gate suffice? Any direction you can give on this would
be helpful.
Best Regards,
Tom Fettig
Graduate Landscape Architect
LML Estate Management
5728 N. Michigan Rd.
Indianapolis, Indiana 46228
317.690.2852 Mobile
317.536.0013 Office
317.536.0021 Fax
3
1
Tom Fettig
From:Ron Farrand <RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us>
Sent:Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:24 AM
To:Tom Fettig
Subject:RE: Gate Project
We do not require a shelter. There needs to be adequate space for students to stand or sit well back from the roadway.
It should be on the side of the entrance so that the bus is not blocking the road into the sub-division when stopped for
pick-up.
Ron Farrand Jr., RA
Director, Facilities and Transportation
Carmel Clay Schools
317-815-3962
Follow: CCS Transportation on Twitter ;
Carmel Clay Schools Transportation on Facebook ;
Carmel Clay Schools Facilities & Transportation Facebook .
From: Tom Fettig [mailto:tomfettig@lmlestatemanagement.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2018 8:20 AM
To: Ron Farrand <RFarrand@ccs.k12.in.us>
Subject: Gate Project
Mr. Farrand,
Hello, I am working on a gate project for a client. The subdivision control ordinance requires a school bus pick-up and
drop-off area for newly constructed gates. I was wondering what that would typically entail. Does Carmel require a
structure or shelter? Or would a park bench located outside the gate suffice? Any direction you can give on this would
be helpful.
Best Regards,
Tom Fettig
Graduate Landscape Architect
LML Estate Management
5728 N. Michigan Rd.
Indianapolis, Indiana 46228
317.690.2852 Mobile
317.536.0013 Office
317.536.0021 Fax
1
Tom Fettig
From:Tom Fettig
Sent:Friday, March 23, 2018 11:33 AM
To:'rodney.johnson@aes.com'
Subject:Estancia Gate Project
Attachments:Estancia Demo Plan.pdf; Estancia Site Conditions.pdf; Estancia Site Plan.pdf; EstanciaWay_lighting
plan.pdf
Mr. Johnson,
Hello, I work for LML Estate Management. I have prepared a plan for a gate the entrance of the Estancia neighborhood
off 106th street. I am in the approval process with the city of Carmel. I need to run the plans by you as the worksite has
three underground powerlines run parallel with the drive. If the lines are below 36” we will not disturb the
lines. However, if the lines are at or above 36” we would have a conflict with the footers for the masonry columns.
What I am proposing is, first, we would hydro-excavated to 36” below grade and see if we have encountered the line or
not. If we encountered the line where it would be in the way of the footer, our mason could bridge over the line and or
install a conduit around the line and through the footer. I understand if IPL would ever have to do work on the line, the
HOA would be responsible for repairs or damages to the line and/or masonry columns. If we can work out some sort of
agreement upon your approval would be ideal.
Any of your thoughts or ideas of how we can make this happen would be great. I have the lines shown in an
elevation/section on the lighting plan, though the elevations are not confirmed.
Let me know what you think.
Best Regards,
Tom Fettig
Graduate Landscape Architect
LML Estate Management
5728 N. Michigan Rd.
Indianapolis, Indiana 46228
317.690.2852 Mobile
317.536.0013 Office
317.536.0021 Fax