HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes Sub 04-01-084F CgR4
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CARMEL PLAN COMMISSION
SUBDIVISION COMMITTEE MINUTES
TUESDAY, APRIL 1, 2008
LOCATION: CAUCUS ROOMS TIME: 6:00 P.M.
CARMEL CITY HALL
ONE CIVIC SQUARE
CARMEL, IN 46032
DOORS OPEN AT 5:30 P.M.
Representing the Committee
Carol Schleif, Chairwoman
Jay Dorman
Dan Dutcher
Steve Stromquist
Representing the Department
Angie Conn
Lisa Stewart
Of Counsel:
John Molitor
Carol Schleif, Chairwoman called the meeting to order at 6:00 p.m.
A vote was taken to elect a Chairperson for the Committee. Jay Dorman nominated Carol
Schleif, a vote of 3 -0 was taken in favor.
The Subdivision Committee will meet to consider the following items:
1. Docket No. 07010008 Z: 116th Guilford Rezone
The applicant seeks to rezone approximately 9.5 acres from I -1 /Industrial to R -1 /Residence. The
site is located at 1441 S. Guilford Rd. Filed by the Carmel Dept. of Community Services.
Bill Wendling, Attorney with Campbell, Kyle and Profitt presented. Mr. Wendling indicated he
was not the petitioner, but rather, was coming in as their representative. He gave an overview of
the current status of the sale of this property. Brighthouse had made a bid for the project, but the
bid was withdrawn due to some possible ground contamination issues. However, IDEM has
indicated that they believe this is not a major problem and the petitioner is waiting for a final
report before moving further on in the sale.
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Dan Dutcher asked Angie Conn what the Department's vision is for the land. Angie responded
that the Department would like to see mixed use and not have any one type of usage stand out in
this corridor.
Carol Schleif discussed CDC regulations regarding contamination within certain distances of RI
areas, where children may be at play. Their exposure needs to be limited. Carol is concerned
about doing an R1.
Bill Wendling indicated that the power station will remain on the property. He reviewed the
uses of property surrounding the area.
Steve Stromquist indicated that he had driven by the area today and could not see the power
station and that it was quite hidden.
Jay Dorman stated he does not see an R1 being planed for this area do to the large investment it
would take. Bill stated that M and B zoning classifications are doable.
Bill Wendling indicated that his client would like to see this item tabled for 1 month. In that
time he will meet with Mike Hollibaugh and Angie Conn to discuss possible rezones.
John Molitor asked if the current, potential buyer is the Brighthouse that is in the same area as
the Fountains. Bill responded correct. John then pointed out that this move could help
congestion in the Fountains area.
Steve Stromquist made a motion to table this item for 30 days to give the petitioner time to
confirm ongoing negotiations with Brighthouse.
Jay Dorman seconded the motion.
Approved 4 -0
2. Docket No. 08030002 CPA: Bicycle Routes Loops Systems Plan
The applicant seeks to amend the Thoroughfare Plan section of the Carmel /Clay Comprehensive
Plan, in order to propose and identify a system of Bicycle Routes and Loops on existing
facilities. Filed by the Carmel Department of Community Services on behalf of the Carmel Plan
Commission
David Littlejohn presented for the Department. At the March Plan Commission meeting the
Department introduced the final result of what the Plan Commission's Special Task Force of the
Bike Routes and Loops had finalized. It consisted of 5 loops and 8 routes. There was a brief
discussion at the meeting regarding what needed to happen for the routes and loops to open up.
The Department would like to get a consensus that these are the routes and loops we want. It
will then be forwarded on to the City Council for a Thoroughfare Amendment.
David is happy to answer any questions you may have. He discussed the issues that were
brought up by the Plan Commission regarding the routes. The Department is aware that there
can be some hazardous or dangerous crossings that need to be addressed, and these will be
addressed when we start to distribute the information. However, the Department feels the
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suggestion to take the routes out of the plan, would not be an ideal resolution. There are other
options to be used going forward, so we think the routes need to continue to be included. The
routes are the connections of this plan and will allow people to commute from one side of the
community to the other, or from the north side down. Without the routes it disconnects the
whole system.
Steve Stromquist asked who suggested taking the routes out. David responded that he was
informed that someone at the Plan Commission had asked that we entertain the idea to just
forward the loops at this time and do an amendment for the routes at a later time, however, this is
not the direction that the Department wants to go.
Dan Dutcher stated that the substance of the plan is fabulous; he felt the biggest concern of the
Plan Commission is about the packaging of the program and how it will be presented to the
community. The distinction of what is a loop, what is a route, what is designated by which
degree of difficulty what is the method of distribution? How do we manage expectations once
this is communicated to the general public? Recognizing dedicated bike riders expect a certain
level of route and there is certain expectation for families out for bike rides with their children. I
think if we have more information about the proposed method of distribution and the distinction
between routes and loops, etc, I think we could get through this pretty quickly.
David stated that he understood the concern about that; we are working on a result.
David had some route maps from Portland, OR and shared these visuals with the Committee.
They show in a very clear way where you have on street facilities, off street facilities, and even
shows with red dotted lines difficult connections. It is clear to see where people of different
levels of cycling where they would feel comfortable and where families would feel comfortable
and at this time, when we are looking at ways to illustrate our routes we have the ability to show
where some facilities will be located, we can show where low travel residential streets will be,
we can show where multi -use paths will be located, we can show where trails will be located on
these maps. We just recently completed an inventory of our alternative transportation system, so
we have the ability to do that pretty quickly. We are still working on a way to package
everything, after approval and we start promoting this, we definitely will have a package to show
how everybody needs to address or use these facilities, however at this time we are looking for is
for this item to move on to the City Council as a Thoroughfare Plan Amendment.
Dan stated that the map from Portland gets to what the concerns of the Plan Commission were,
i.e. it clearly shows different areas with different types of terrains and experience levels.
David passed out some copies of the Alternative Transportation plan and reviewed areas that
show there is to be an overpass location and grade separation with pedestrian crossing on SR 31.
David stated that the overall intention is to distribute brochures. It will also be posted online, so
people should be knowledgeable about any dead ends or routes they are supposed to take. Even
though our system is immature at this time, it is the Department's hope that in the future we will
have an integrated map.
Jay Dorman suggested that the Committee members all seem to like to the red dashed line of
Portland, so suggested that future versions be done showing another color across Meridian that
would label it a dangerous intersection.
David indicated that they will put the maps on the website as well. David stressed that at this
point the Department is really focusing on the Thoroughfare Plan Amendment. At the same time
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we are trying to get the packaging ready to go. David stated that they would like to unveil a plan
in May because it is Bike Month and Bike Week, so the Department is trying to work quickly,
but obviously we will not be able to have the signs up at that time. So in the beginning, folks
will need to try and follow the maps without visual markings on the road.
Ron Carter, City Councilman indicated that safety was the paramount concern of the Plan
Commission and that the Task Force members have all ridden the routes, and are all experienced
bike riders. The Task Force includes two past Plan Commission members and the Chair is a
Plan Commission member. He stated that Kevin Heber is a very experienced bicyclist who
helped to design these routes and who has ridden them to determine safety. He was on the
lookout for hazards and safety concerns. The area on US 31 that was chosen to be the crossing
area was determined by Kevin to be the best option at this time. The loops are for families, the
routes are for more experienced riders who would commute utilize the cross city routes. The
maps and the website would contain messages that were different for each of those two groups.
The commuters would have free rein on this knowing that they can and will ride appropriately
and ride safely. On the family routes there will be cautionary language throughout the website
and the maps for them to be aware of those areas that could more difficult and for them to make.
Ron stated that Kevin Heber is the best at finding safe, residential street to ride. We now have
an extensive bike infrastructure that is available for riding.
Carol asked if there will be separate route and loop maps. Ron replied that on the website that
would be the case, but on paper maps it would be included into one.
Nick Kestner, Task Force Member stated that the group is aware that there are some dangerous
intersections and will continue to work on future routes and loops.
Jay Dorman asked that whenever the bike paths cross Meridian or Keystone that red dot be
applied to the legend as difficult crossing.
Dan Dutcher made a motion to recommend back to the full Plan Commission a favorable
recommendation to move on to the City Council, noting concerns about trying to maximize the
appropriate way to present to the public is responsive to the different uses that are intended and
to the different safety concerns that we have identified.
Steve Stromquist seconded the motion.
Approved 4 -0
Jay Dorman made a motion to adjourn the meeting.
Steve Stromquist seconded the motion.
Approved 4 -0
Meeting adjourned at 7:00 p.m.
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Carol Schleif, Chairwoman Lisa Stewart
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